MASS SHOOTING THREAD - Society has reached somekind of inflection point

[aurelius]

The news outlets that love to point out how often white males commit mass shooting are tripping over their own feet to explain how rare it is that a MtF transgender person woman just shot up a school and I have a headache....

White males commit mass shootings at a greater rate than any other demographic in the United States. That is pertinent to point out when discussing mass shootings.

What is the significance of this shooter being transgender? To my knowledge transgender individuals are more likely to die by suicide and be victims of sexual assault than any other demographic. I don't know of any crime statistic showing transgender individuals commit violent crimes at a greater rate than the general population.

Hale was an illustrator and graphic designer who used he/him pronouns, according to a police spokesperson. Police said Hale was transgender and they initially identified him by his birth name and gender. Based on this sentence the shooter was a FtM transgender person.

I find the more interesting demoographic aspects are the age and biological sex of the shooter. 28 is old for a school shooter. To my knowledge, there has not been a school shooter older than 25 until today. From an article: Female mass shooters are exceedingly rare in the United States, according to FBI data. Of 61 active shooter incidents in 2021, 60 were perpetrated by males and only one was carried out by a female.

[Hardartery]

The news outlets that love to point out how often white males commit mass shooting are tripping over their own feet to explain how rare it is that a MtF transgender person woman just shot up a school and I have a headache....

White males commit mass shootings at a greater rate than any other demographic in the United States. That is pertinent to point out when discussing mass shootings.

What is the significance of this shooter being transgender? To my knowledge transgender individuals are more likely to die by suicide and be victims of sexual assault than any other demographic. I don't know of any crime statistic showing transgender individuals commit violent crimes at a greater rate than the general population.

Hale was an illustrator and graphic designer who used he/him pronouns, according to a police spokesperson. Police said Hale was transgender and they initially identified him by his birth name and gender. Based on this sentence the shooter was a FtM transgender person.

I find the more interesting demoographic aspects are the age and biological sex of the shooter. 28 is old for a school shooter. To my knowledge, there has not been a school shooter older than 25 until today. From an article: Female mass shooters are exceedingly rare in the United States, according to FBI data. Of 61 active shooter incidents in 2021, 60 were perpetrated by males and only one was carried out by a female.

The fact that it was a school of that narrow age group kind of leans one's thinking towards the idea that this former student of that school may have suffered some form of abuse there - I would be unsurprised to find it that there was sexual abuse. I have nothing to back that up, just my gut telling me that, and I hope that I am wrong either way.

[mouse]

White males commit mass shootings at a greater rate than any other demographic in the United States. That is pertinent to point out when discussing mass shootings.

What is the significance of this shooter being transgender? To my knowledge transgender individuals are more likely to die by suicide and be victims of sexual assault than any other demographic. I don't know of any crime statistic showing transgender individuals commit violent crimes at a greater rate than the general population.

Hale was an illustrator and graphic designer who used he/him pronouns, according to a police spokesperson. Police said Hale was transgender and they initially identified him by his birth name and gender. Based on this sentence the shooter was a FtM transgender person.

Clearly I don't know the rules for media anymore...

After seeing some of the articles this morning you seem to be correct that this is a FtM individual.

Up until this moment I figured the information being reported was based on who this person identified as, but apparently media is cool with misgendering someone post-mortem if they've committed a heinous crime.

In hindsight I should have just shut my mouth, because nothing but trouble will come of this, and I honestly don't care, I just found it a bit absurd.

How are they tripping over the feet? Who is trying to "explain" it? What does that even mean?

Hope that clears it up. I thought the news was crediting a statistical rarity (a female shooting up a school) to a biological male who identified as a female and I found it absurd.

I still find it absurd, but for other reasons now.

I still have a headache.

[mbasic]

White males commit mass shootings at a greater rate than any other demographic in the United States. That is pertinent to point out when discussing mass shootings.

source for this?
this strike me as odd (not from some kind of whitepride point of view)

You sure whites are out of proportion here with their proportion of the general population?
(62% of USA pop is white; so you are saying something like 85% of mass-shooters are white )

and

But I thought the FBIs definition for mass shoot was really low, like "more than 2" or 3 three people = "mass".
So gang violence stuff would tally up a lot of mass shootings.
Which usually happens in poorer communities (black, latino, etc), which are often minorities, because of white male patriarchy/racism/oppression reasons obvs.


EDIT Found this:
https://www.statista.com/statistics/476 ... er-s-race/

says 51% white; 17% black; 7% latin. And "mass" = 3 or more dead

Between 1982 and March 2023, 73 out of the 141 mass shootings in the United States 73 were carried out by white shooters. By comparison, the perpetrator was African American in 25 mass shootings, and Latino in 11. When calculated as percentages, this amounts to 51 percent, 17 percent, and seven percent respectively.

Race of mass shooters reflects the U.S. population
Broadly speaking, the racial distribution of mass shootings mirrors the racial distribution of the U.S. population as a whole. While a superficial comparison of the statistics seems to suggest African American shooters are over-represented and Latino shooters underrepresented, the fact that the shooter’s race is unclear in around nine percent of cases, along with the different time frames over which these statistics are calculated, means no such conclusions should be drawn. Conversely, looking at the mass shootings in the United States by gender clearly demonstrates that the majority of mass shootings are carried out by men.

I mean, also if you "go back" to 1990, the white population was 80% then too.

[BostonRugger]

White males commit mass shootings at a greater rate than any other demographic in the United States. That is pertinent to point out when discussing mass shootings.

Following this rule consistently would lead us to say some unpopular things about shootings or homicides as a whole.

[mbasic]

White males commit mass shootings at a greater rate than any other demographic in the United States. That is pertinent to point out when discussing mass shootings.

Following this rule consistently would lead us to say some unpopular things about shootings or homicides as a whole.

Can't believe there's been only 141 mass shootings (since '82) according to that Statistca Thingy I found.

I wonder how many total deaths that 141 incidents encompasses? ... compared to .... say, in two years of homicides in Chicago? 695 in 2022 alone?
Its probably 1000 over 2 years.

Yes, clearly the BIG problem is US is the previously entitled white males becoming looney/disenfranchised from how modern society is going and lashing out or loosing their marbles ..... or whatever the narrative is. Sure, that might be happening, but that's barely adding to the total death count.

[5hout]

White males commit mass shootings at a greater rate than any other demographic in the United States. That is pertinent to point out when discussing mass shootings.

Following this rule consistently would lead us to say some unpopular things about shootings or homicides as a whole.

Don't think those bad thoughts, just push them down. This is definitely a nationwide problem that requires constant attention and not a statistically irrelevant problem buoyed to relevance on the back of inner city crime.

[lheugh]

610 mass shootings in the US in 2020, 690 in 2021, and 647 in 2022 - that is insane. Even keeping in mind these are defined as incidents in which four or more people are injured or killed (including shootings that happen in homes and in public places), it is startling to say the least.

[aurelius]

Following this rule consistently would lead us to say some unpopular things about shootings or homicides as a whole.

really? How so?

For example: black people make up 13% of the population but account for ~30% of non-fatal violent crime. And account for something like 50% of fatal violent crime. This is talked about a lot. And should be as it is a serious issue.

The underlying causes of violent crime in black communities (poverty, illegal drug trade) are very different from the lone wolf type school shootings (social isolation, mental health). I don’t see how discussing violent crime in Black Communities or other non related issues is relevant when the subject is lone wolf mass shootings.

This is Whataboutism to distract from a serious problem. None of us had to go to public school and perform active shooter drills. What the fuck are we doing here guys?

[BostonRugger]

Following this rule consistently would lead us to say some unpopular things about shootings or homicides as a whole.

really? How so?

For example: black people make up 13% of the population but account for ~30% of non-fatal violent crime. And account for something like 50% of fatal violent crime. This is talked about a lot. And should be as it is a serious issue.

The underlying causes of violent crime in black communities (poverty, illegal drug trade) are very different from the lone wolf type school shootings (social isolation, mental health). I don’t see how discussing violent crime in Black Communities or other non related issues is relevant when the subject is lone wolf mass shootings.

Shit like this is Whataboutism to distract from a serious problem. None of us had to go to public school and perform active shooter drills. What the fuck are we doing here guys?

The 97% of gun homicides that are not mass shootings are a much more serious problem.

[aurelius]

Following this rule consistently would lead us to say some unpopular things about shootings or homicides as a whole.

really? How so?

For example: black people make up 13% of the population but account for ~30% of non-fatal violent crime. And account for something like 50% of fatal violent crime. This is talked about a lot. And should be as it is a serious issue.

The underlying causes of violent crime in black communities (poverty, illegal drug trade) are very different from the lone wolf type school shootings (social isolation, mental health). I don’t see how discussing violent crime in Black Communities or other non related issues is relevant when the subject is lone wolf mass shootings.

Shit like this is Whataboutism to distract from a serious problem. None of us had to go to public school and perform active shooter drills. What the fuck are we doing here guys?

The 97% of gun homicides that are not mass shootings are a much more serious problem.

And since you feel this way, you should start a thread about that problem where it can be fully discussed without being weighed down with the distraction of school shootings.

[aurelius]

White males commit mass shootings at a greater rate than any other demographic in the United States. That is pertinent to point out when discussing mass shootings.

source for this?

Depends on how one define mass shootings. Lone wolf type mass shootings white males are over represented. As the FBI defines mass shootings, that includes shootings related to other types of crime. I alluded in another post: I do not believe it is useful to lump all crime together as the underlying causes are very different.

[SSJBartSimpson]

Following this rule consistently would lead us to say some unpopular things about shootings or homicides as a whole.

really? How so?

For example: black people make up 13% of the population but account for ~30% of non-fatal violent crime. And account for something like 50% of fatal violent crime. This is talked about a lot. And should be as it is a serious issue.

The underlying causes of violent crime in black communities (poverty, illegal drug trade) are very different from the lone wolf type school shootings (social isolation, mental health). I don’t see how discussing violent crime in Black Communities or other non related issues is relevant when the subject is lone wolf mass shootings.

Shit like this is Whataboutism to distract from a serious problem. None of us had to go to public school and perform active shooter drills. What the fuck are we doing here guys?

The 97% of gun homicides that are not mass shootings are a much more serious problem.

Why? Who says, you?

[BostonRugger]

Graphic

[BostonRugger]

Following this rule consistently would lead us to say some unpopular things about shootings or homicides as a whole.

really? How so?

For example: black people make up 13% of the population but account for ~30% of non-fatal violent crime. And account for something like 50% of fatal violent crime. This is talked about a lot. And should be as it is a serious issue.

The underlying causes of violent crime in black communities (poverty, illegal drug trade) are very different from the lone wolf type school shootings (social isolation, mental health). I don’t see how discussing violent crime in Black Communities or other non related issues is relevant when the subject is lone wolf mass shootings.

Shit like this is Whataboutism to distract from a serious problem. None of us had to go to public school and perform active shooter drills. What the fuck are we doing here guys?

The 97% of gun homicides that are not mass shootings are a much more serious problem.

Why? Who says, you?

Yes. I do. I say that 22,000 homicides are more serious than 675. Because I'm not a drooling moron.

[aurelius]

Graphic

the police were brave. Placed expediency above personal safety to find and neutralize the shooter quickly. Multiple times they breached a room or door without hesitation. This was good work.

Side note: everyone talks about AR-15 but the king of CQC is the shotgun.

[SSJBartSimpson]

Following this rule consistently would lead us to say some unpopular things about shootings or homicides as a whole.

really? How so?

For example: black people make up 13% of the population but account for ~30% of non-fatal violent crime. And account for something like 50% of fatal violent crime. This is talked about a lot. And should be as it is a serious issue.

The underlying causes of violent crime in black communities (poverty, illegal drug trade) are very different from the lone wolf type school shootings (social isolation, mental health). I don’t see how discussing violent crime in Black Communities or other non related issues is relevant when the subject is lone wolf mass shootings.

Shit like this is Whataboutism to distract from a serious problem. None of us had to go to public school and perform active shooter drills. What the fuck are we doing here guys?

The 97% of gun homicides that are not mass shootings are a much more serious problem.

Why? Who says, you?

Yes. I do. I say that 22,000 homicides are more serious than 675. Because I'm not a drooling moron.

Well then I'm a drooling moron for thinking they're problems that need equal amounts of attention. [:

[BostonRugger]

Following this rule consistently would lead us to say some unpopular things about shootings or homicides as a whole.

really? How so?

For example: black people make up 13% of the population but account for ~30% of non-fatal violent crime. And account for something like 50% of fatal violent crime. This is talked about a lot. And should be as it is a serious issue.

The underlying causes of violent crime in black communities (poverty, illegal drug trade) are very different from the lone wolf type school shootings (social isolation, mental health). I don’t see how discussing violent crime in Black Communities or other non related issues is relevant when the subject is lone wolf mass shootings.

Shit like this is Whataboutism to distract from a serious problem. None of us had to go to public school and perform active shooter drills. What the fuck are we doing here guys?

The 97% of gun homicides that are not mass shootings are a much more serious problem.

Why? Who says, you?

Yes. I do. I say that 22,000 homicides are more serious than 675. Because I'm not a drooling moron.

Well then I'm a drooling moron for thinking they're problems that need equal amounts of attention. [:

In the absence of an explanation for why one would think that, I’m forced to agree.

[SSJBartSimpson]

In the absence of an explanation for why one would think that, I’m forced to agree.

The causes of the these issues have overlap (gun access and education, poverty, mental health) that are worth addressing for the sake of addressing them. If you are going to address one of the causes, why would you narrowly focus on only one outcome when you can improve the outcomes anywhere? That's my main thought.
And for a more selfish reason, the gun violence happening in these impoverished communities, while tragic and needing to be addressed, has a much lower likelihood of affecting me than somebody shooting up my grocery store.

[mikeylikey]

And for a more selfish reason, the gun violence happening in these impoverished communities, while tragic and needing to be addressed, has a much lower likelihood of affecting me than somebody shooting up my grocery store.

Closely related to the phenomenon that plane crashes get more attention than car crashes. Car crashes kill way more people but we all tend to think "yeah but I'm a Good Driver" - whereas the factors that cause a plane crash are entirely out of your control.