Coronavirus

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BostonRugger
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Re: Coronavirus

#9381

Post by BostonRugger » Wed Feb 01, 2023 12:57 pm

mbasic wrote: Wed Feb 01, 2023 11:08 am pretty good video debunking the persistent all-cause excess-death phenomenon going on all over the world right now possibly being vaccines.

TL;DR = More cancer deaths from no cancer screenings during lockdowns. Heart disease from covid-flu-like-virus, and a lack of heart disease screenings also.


However, I spin it a couple of different ways:

'merica, and all the other 1st-world-obese-fucked-up-think-they're-hot-shit countries ARE SO FUCKING FRAGILE, you go about 6 to 12 months without your cancer screenings, etc. You pay dearly down the road with excess cancer deaths.
We (USA et al) have gotten so fucking good (or think we are) at detecting and fighting (but losing) cancer, you take a little teeny break from that and the whole population falls apart. This is a pretty good sign medicine and/or the gov't has failed us: The elephant in the room in cancer and heart disease from die-a-beat-U.S. and obesity. Not the Covids.

I don't buy the medical system / hospital infrastructure was overloaded due to covid in sense that this overload would/should/could put a damper on cancer screenings, etc. Mammogram devices and/or butt-hole-checks (colorectal exams) aren't the same set of tools used to fend off waves of covid (Emergency rooms, hospitals, etc) patients. Correct me if I'm wrong, those aren't pulling from the same pool of medical infrastructure. Maybe a little, sure. But it should have been NOTHING like what was shown in that video (8:32 mark).
So what happened? in general society was shut down and/or old people scared as fuck (for little to no reason becuz fear-porn) to go see the doctor clinic/lab to get some tests exams done? Either way its a total failure of the gov't and our medical system.

Another thought, it early on in this thread, when some of us 'macabre or morbid' types were discussing how this would all effect the economy, taxes, wealth distribution, voting demographic shift, etc. when a whole generation of old people die from covid ..... well, it would appear the gift-that-keeps-on-giving thing is gonna happen. Hopefully we are getting over it now.
Curious how many years it will be before things level out.
It's a nice non-window-related example of the seen and the unseen. Seen: people stay home and don't transmit covid to one another. Unseen: joyful surprises still being revealed.

Philbert
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Re: Coronavirus

#9382

Post by Philbert » Wed Feb 01, 2023 7:15 pm

mbasic wrote: Wed Feb 01, 2023 11:08 am pretty good video debunking the persistent all-cause excess-death phenomenon going on all over the world right now possibly being vaccines.

TL;DR = More cancer deaths from no cancer screenings during lockdowns. Heart disease from covid-flu-like-virus, and a lack of heart disease screenings also.



'merica, and all the other 1st-world-obese-fucked-up-think-they're-hot-shit countries ARE SO FUCKING FRAGILE, you go about 6 to 12 months without your cancer screenings, etc. You pay dearly down the road with excess cancer deaths.
We (USA et al) have gotten so fucking good (or think we are) at detecting and fighting (but losing) cancer, you take a little teeny break from that and the whole population falls apart. This is a pretty good sign medicine and/or the gov't has failed us: The elephant in the room in cancer and heart disease from die-a-beat-U.S. and obesity. Not the Covids.

I don't buy the medical system / hospital infrastructure was overloaded due to covid in sense that this overload would/should/could put a damper on cancer screenings, etc. Mammogram devices and/or butt-hole-checks (colorectal exams) aren't the same set of tools used to fend off waves of covid (Emergency rooms, hospitals, etc) patients. Correct me if I'm wrong, those aren't pulling from the same pool of medical infrastructure. Maybe a little, sure. But it should have been NOTHING like what was shown in that video (8:32 mark).
So what happened? in general society was shut down and/or old people scared as fuck (for little to no reason becuz fear-porn) to go see the doctor clinic/lab to get some tests exams done? Either way its a total failure of the gov't and our medical system.

Another thought, it early on in this thread, when some of us 'macabre or morbid' types were discussing how this would all effect the economy, taxes, wealth distribution, voting demographic shift, etc. when a whole generation of old people die from covid ..... well, it would appear the gift-that-keeps-on-giving thing is gonna happen. Hopefully we are getting over it now.
Curious how many years it will be before things level out.
I think we will see the last of the new problems from the Covid response when the kids who were in first grade for the pandemic enter the job market. That will not be the end of the consequences of 3 years of national health emergency, or even the beginning of the end, but it will be the end of the beginning.
As to increased all cause mortality, all the things you mentioned, and more. Safety net and tertiary hospitals (often the same place) are even more overwhelmed than they were before due to persistent staffing and supply chain issues. Nursing homes and home care agencies are understaffed, some available staff are underqualified.

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mbasic
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Re: Coronavirus

#9383

Post by mbasic » Thu Feb 02, 2023 5:11 pm

mbasic wrote: Fri Jan 20, 2023 4:49 am
Orthrus now

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mbasic
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Re: Coronavirus

#9384

Post by mbasic » Tue Feb 21, 2023 4:13 am

So I guess there was a study in Denmark, and it seems the mRNA componet of the vaccine can be found floating around in the blood for as long as 28 days after infection (in about 10% of the vaxxed folks). What's funny too, is Denmark DOES DO the aspiration thing with the needle, insuring you are not injecting it in a blood vessel.

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/apm.13294
n 10 of 108 HCV patient samples, full-length or traces of SARS-CoV-2 spike mRNA vaccine sequences were found in blood up to 28 days after COVID-19 vaccination. Detection of mRNA vaccine sequences in blood after vaccination adds important knowledge regarding this technology and should lead to further research into the design of lipid-nanoparticles and the half-life of these and mRNA vaccines in humans.
The original story was:
- the mRNA component degraded very fast, hours to a couple of days
- the shot is intermuscular, and the vaccine would stay in the muscle, and that's where the immune response would take place.

Could it be replicating? Could be just floating around, fucking with blood vessels, and your heart tissue, etc.
(I think they found it in the spleen too.)



Not trying to be a conspiracy theorist or anything, as this one^ particular aspect may or may not matter much in the grand scheme of things...BUT as with many aspects of the human body, much of this shit is hardly understood, OR we are only at tip-of-the-ice-berg-level knowledge, and there's unintended consequences to a lot of these new 'inventions' that the medical/healthcare/pharma industry doesn't know about .... or didn't care to study this aspect at all; or they flat out lied, so neither is good.

....we are arrogant, and corrupted by the opportunity to make a profit on a world-wide pseudo-crisis.

ChasingCurls69
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Re: Coronavirus

#9385

Post by ChasingCurls69 » Tue Feb 21, 2023 8:35 pm

mbasic wrote: Tue Feb 21, 2023 4:13 am So I guess there was a study in Denmark, and it seems the mRNA componet of the vaccine can be found floating around in the blood for as long as 28 days after infection (in about 10% of the vaxxed folks). What's funny too, is Denmark DOES DO the aspiration thing with the needle, insuring you are not injecting it in a blood vessel.

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/apm.13294
n 10 of 108 HCV patient samples, full-length or traces of SARS-CoV-2 spike mRNA vaccine sequences were found in blood up to 28 days after COVID-19 vaccination. Detection of mRNA vaccine sequences in blood after vaccination adds important knowledge regarding this technology and should lead to further research into the design of lipid-nanoparticles and the half-life of these and mRNA vaccines in humans.
The original story was:
- the mRNA component degraded very fast, hours to a couple of days
- the shot is intermuscular, and the vaccine would stay in the muscle, and that's where the immune response would take place.

Could it be replicating? Could be just floating around, fucking with blood vessels, and your heart tissue, etc.
(I think they found it in the spleen too.)



Not trying to be a conspiracy theorist or anything, as this one^ particular aspect may or may not matter much in the grand scheme of things...BUT as with many aspects of the human body, much of this shit is hardly understood, OR we are only at tip-of-the-ice-berg-level knowledge, and there's unintended consequences to a lot of these new 'inventions' that the medical/healthcare/pharma industry doesn't know about .... or didn't care to study this aspect at all; or they flat out lied, so neither is good.

....we are arrogant, and corrupted by the opportunity to make a profit on a world-wide pseudo-crisis.
Yeah, or even just a really prolonged immune system response because spikes keep getting produced

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mbasic
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Re: Coronavirus

#9386

Post by mbasic » Wed Feb 22, 2023 4:26 am

ChasingCurls69 wrote: Tue Feb 21, 2023 8:35 pm Yeah, or even just a really prolonged immune system response because spikes keep getting produced
No, from what I understand they found the original something that looks like the original mRNA vaccine floating around.
That should be gone in a few days or sooner.

The spikes that the mRNA produces are different from the vaccine itself,

AND ALSO, those "fake-spikes" are slightly different than the real spike of the covid virus to where they can tell.
That what engineered to happen so the vaccine generated spikes would be harmful in some ways.

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KyleSchuant
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Re: Coronavirus

#9387

Post by KyleSchuant » Thu Feb 23, 2023 1:59 am

mbasic wrote: Tue Feb 21, 2023 4:13 am Not trying to be a conspiracy theorist or anything, as this one^ particular aspect may or may not matter much in the grand scheme of things...BUT as with many aspects of the human body, much of this shit is hardly understood, OR we are only at tip-of-the-ice-berg-level knowledge, and there's unintended consequences to a lot of these new 'inventions' that the medical/healthcare/pharma industry doesn't know about .... or didn't care to study this aspect at all; or they flat out lied, so neither is good.

....we are arrogant, and corrupted by the opportunity to make a profit on a world-wide pseudo-crisis.
Well, all possible. But also likely they were just all in a hysterical tearing hurry to get something out of the lab vats and into people's arms, so everything was kind of rushed and half-arsed. And the reasoning would be something like, "well if the virus kills 10 in 1,000 people and the vaccine kills 2 in 1,000, that's better, let's go." Completely made-up figures but you get the picture. Like chemo for the elderly or something.

I can understand all that. It's the bullshitting they did that gets me, and silencing anyone who said, "um, excuse me...?"

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Re: Coronavirus

#9388

Post by mbasic » Sun Mar 26, 2023 3:27 pm


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Brackish
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Re: Coronavirus

#9389

Post by Brackish » Mon Mar 27, 2023 7:49 am

mbasic wrote: Sun Mar 26, 2023 3:27 pm
Presented without comment? I've read this dude is a quack...

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Re: Coronavirus

#9390

Post by mbasic » Mon Mar 27, 2023 8:15 am

Brackish wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 7:49 am
mbasic wrote: Sun Mar 26, 2023 3:27 pm
Presented without comment? I've read this dude is a quack...actually, both of them are.
Did you watch the video? I can't put a few words into a simple TL;DW synopsis, sorry.

And Sources for allegations of quackery?

Funny becasue Dr. Campbell was very pro vaccine/pro mask/pro social interview for much of the (beginning of the) pandemic.
That/he changed once the data on natural immunity came out, coupled with the fact omicron was 'different', and those two things verses the whole risk vs reward calcs at that point going forward.

Some of the (factual) stuff is still really interesting ...how the mucosal immunity system works. And say why you don't compare a measles vaccine to something the akin to reparatory infection, or starts that way (flu, C19, etc).....and why some of that works very well (measles, tetanus), and some vaccines don't (flu, C19, etc).

I'm glad my daughter got the non-mNRA version the (pseudo-)vaccine.
We left it up to her .... we didn't care that much.
But wife and I thought it was extra extra stupid since she had tested positive for it once (natural immunity), is 20 y.o., and in good health..
Since she is in the nursing program at college, they MADE her get it.

Other facts are interesting. Like the virus can only infect certain cells with the right receptors. Where as the mRNA vaccine, can get into almost any cell. The virus starts at the lung, and/or respiratory tract ....sure it moves on from there, but that's where the main battle ground is or should be. The vaccine is shot straight into the blood/tissues of the body.

None of this stuff was rigorously tested over a long term period for long term side-effect as it should of been.

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Brackish
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Re: Coronavirus

#9391

Post by Brackish » Mon Mar 27, 2023 8:59 am

mbasic wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 8:15 am
Brackish wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 7:49 am
mbasic wrote: Sun Mar 26, 2023 3:27 pm
Presented without comment? I've read this dude is a quack...actually, both of them are.
Did you watch the video? I can't put a few words into a simple TL;DW synopsis, sorry.

And Sources for allegations of quackery?


Funny becasue Dr. Campbell was very pro vaccine/pro mask/pro social interview for much of the (beginning of the) pandemic.
That/he changed once the data on natural immunity came out, coupled with the fact omicron was 'different', and those two things verses the whole risk vs reward calcs at that point going forward.

Some of the (factual) stuff is still really interesting ...how the mucosal immunity system works. And say why you don't compare a measles vaccine to something the akin to reparatory infection, or starts that way (flu, C19, etc).....and why some of that works very well (measles, tetanus), and some vaccines don't (flu, C19, etc).

I'm glad my daughter got the non-mNRA version the (pseudo-)vaccine.
We left it up to her .... we didn't care that much.
But wife and I thought it was extra extra stupid since she had tested positive for it once (natural immunity), is 20 y.o., and in good health..
Since she is in the nursing program at college, they MADE her get it.

Other facts are interesting. Like the virus can only infect certain cells with the right receptors. Where as the mRNA vaccine, can get into almost any cell. The virus starts at the lung, and/or respiratory tract ....sure it moves on from there, but that's where the main battle ground is or should be. The vaccine is shot straight into the blood/tissues of the body.

None of this stuff was rigorously tested over a long term period for long term side-effect as it should of been.
Nah, didn't bother. Like I said, he's a quack. See sources below.

https://www.factcheck.org/person/john-campbell/

https://fullfact.org/health/john-campbe ... -children/

https://healthfeedback.org/authors/john-campbell/

"Then on 20 January, Dr John Campbell, a retired nurse educator who has amassed a huge following on YouTube, released a video describing the figures as a "huge story" and suggested Covid deaths were "much lower than mainstream media seems to have been intimating"."

https://www.bbc.com/news/60145237

And if you're really bored, you can click on all the fun sources for his Wikipedia page.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Campbell_(YouTuber)

Etc., etc., etc...

Quack.

Not going to argue discuss the whole testing protocol for vaccines. I've been down that road one too many times and have zero desire to repeat it.

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Re: Coronavirus

#9392

Post by hector » Sun Apr 09, 2023 1:03 pm

Brackish wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 8:59 am
mbasic wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 8:15 am
Brackish wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 7:49 am
mbasic wrote: Sun Mar 26, 2023 3:27 pm
Presented without comment? I've read this dude is a quack...actually, both of them are.
Did you watch the video? I can't put a few words into a simple TL;DW synopsis, sorry.

And Sources for allegations of quackery?


Funny becasue Dr. Campbell was very pro vaccine/pro mask/pro social interview for much of the (beginning of the) pandemic.
That/he changed once the data on natural immunity came out, coupled with the fact omicron was 'different', and those two things verses the whole risk vs reward calcs at that point going forward.

Some of the (factual) stuff is still really interesting ...how the mucosal immunity system works. And say why you don't compare a measles vaccine to something the akin to reparatory infection, or starts that way (flu, C19, etc).....and why some of that works very well (measles, tetanus), and some vaccines don't (flu, C19, etc).

I'm glad my daughter got the non-mNRA version the (pseudo-)vaccine.
We left it up to her .... we didn't care that much.
But wife and I thought it was extra extra stupid since she had tested positive for it once (natural immunity), is 20 y.o., and in good health..
Since she is in the nursing program at college, they MADE her get it.

Other facts are interesting. Like the virus can only infect certain cells with the right receptors. Where as the mRNA vaccine, can get into almost any cell. The virus starts at the lung, and/or respiratory tract ....sure it moves on from there, but that's where the main battle ground is or should be. The vaccine is shot straight into the blood/tissues of the body.

None of this stuff was rigorously tested over a long term period for long term side-effect as it should of been.
Nah, didn't bother. Like I said, he's a quack. See sources below.

https://www.factcheck.org/person/john-campbell/

https://fullfact.org/health/john-campbe ... -children/

https://healthfeedback.org/authors/john-campbell/

"Then on 20 January, Dr John Campbell, a retired nurse educator who has amassed a huge following on YouTube, released a video describing the figures as a "huge story" and suggested Covid deaths were "much lower than mainstream media seems to have been intimating"."

https://www.bbc.com/news/60145237

And if you're really bored, you can click on all the fun sources for his Wikipedia page.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Campbell_(YouTuber)

Etc., etc., etc...

Quack.

Not going to argue discuss the whole testing protocol for vaccines. I've been down that road one too many times and have zero desire to repeat it.
I didn’t watch the video and don’t care about this individual, but the idea that Covid deaths were initially over-counted seems reasonable. (From-Covid and with-Covid may have been initially conflated.)
I think imperfection of initial counts has been acknowledged, this doesn’t seem like quackery territory.

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Brackish
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Re: Coronavirus

#9393

Post by Brackish » Tue Apr 11, 2023 1:36 pm

hector wrote: Sun Apr 09, 2023 1:03 pm
Brackish wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 8:59 am
mbasic wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 8:15 am
Brackish wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 7:49 am
mbasic wrote: Sun Mar 26, 2023 3:27 pm
Presented without comment? I've read this dude is a quack...actually, both of them are.
Did you watch the video? I can't put a few words into a simple TL;DW synopsis, sorry.

And Sources for allegations of quackery?


Funny becasue Dr. Campbell was very pro vaccine/pro mask/pro social interview for much of the (beginning of the) pandemic.
That/he changed once the data on natural immunity came out, coupled with the fact omicron was 'different', and those two things verses the whole risk vs reward calcs at that point going forward.

Some of the (factual) stuff is still really interesting ...how the mucosal immunity system works. And say why you don't compare a measles vaccine to something the akin to reparatory infection, or starts that way (flu, C19, etc).....and why some of that works very well (measles, tetanus), and some vaccines don't (flu, C19, etc).

I'm glad my daughter got the non-mNRA version the (pseudo-)vaccine.
We left it up to her .... we didn't care that much.
But wife and I thought it was extra extra stupid since she had tested positive for it once (natural immunity), is 20 y.o., and in good health..
Since she is in the nursing program at college, they MADE her get it.

Other facts are interesting. Like the virus can only infect certain cells with the right receptors. Where as the mRNA vaccine, can get into almost any cell. The virus starts at the lung, and/or respiratory tract ....sure it moves on from there, but that's where the main battle ground is or should be. The vaccine is shot straight into the blood/tissues of the body.

None of this stuff was rigorously tested over a long term period for long term side-effect as it should of been.
Nah, didn't bother. Like I said, he's a quack. See sources below.

https://www.factcheck.org/person/john-campbell/

https://fullfact.org/health/john-campbe ... -children/

https://healthfeedback.org/authors/john-campbell/

"Then on 20 January, Dr John Campbell, a retired nurse educator who has amassed a huge following on YouTube, released a video describing the figures as a "huge story" and suggested Covid deaths were "much lower than mainstream media seems to have been intimating"."

https://www.bbc.com/news/60145237

And if you're really bored, you can click on all the fun sources for his Wikipedia page.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Campbell_(YouTuber)

Etc., etc., etc...

Quack.

Not going to argue discuss the whole testing protocol for vaccines. I've been down that road one too many times and have zero desire to repeat it.
I didn’t watch the video and don’t care about this individual, but the idea that Covid deaths were initially over-counted seems reasonable. (From-Covid and with-Covid may have been initially conflated.)
I think imperfection of initial counts has been acknowledged, this doesn’t seem like quackery territory.
"Deaths which would not have been counted in the 17,000 include people with asthma, diabetes, an irregular heartbeat or high blood pressure - all conditions with which many can expect to live a normal lifespan. In other words, these are not terminal conditions that would have killed people had they not caught Covid."

https://www.bbc.com/news/60145237

It is quackery territory in the sense that the individual in question positions himself as a respectable source of knowledge but then engages in click-bait style discussions. I'm sure the statistics on Covid deaths weren't 100% accurate. Nothing is. But that doesn't mean that only 17,000 people (like he claimed) died from Covid and the rest of the deaths were made up. Like the article said, many of the deaths discounted in the 17,000 people figure ignores deaths from people with high blood pressure who, you know, weren't dead prior to contracting Covid. I picked that condition because it's not exactly "rare". 47% of the U.S. (based of quick Google-Fu) population has it - see link below.

To be clear - I'm not picking on this dude because he's part of the anti-Covid crowd. I'm picking on him because he's full of shit, and as a medical professional, he should know better. Which means, to me, that one of two things are true - either he's dumb (doubtful) or he's deliberately misleading in his presentation of information in order to support his own views (which also happen to be nonsense in this particular case), which would qualify for quackery.

https://www.cdc.gov/bloodpressure/facts.htm

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Re: Coronavirus

#9394

Post by hector » Tue Apr 11, 2023 1:57 pm

Brackish wrote: Tue Apr 11, 2023 1:36 pm
hector wrote: Sun Apr 09, 2023 1:03 pm
Brackish wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 8:59 am
mbasic wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 8:15 am
Brackish wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 7:49 am
mbasic wrote: Sun Mar 26, 2023 3:27 pm
Presented without comment? I've read this dude is a quack...actually, both of them are.
Did you watch the video? I can't put a few words into a simple TL;DW synopsis, sorry.

And Sources for allegations of quackery?


Funny becasue Dr. Campbell was very pro vaccine/pro mask/pro social interview for much of the (beginning of the) pandemic.
That/he changed once the data on natural immunity came out, coupled with the fact omicron was 'different', and those two things verses the whole risk vs reward calcs at that point going forward.

Some of the (factual) stuff is still really interesting ...how the mucosal immunity system works. And say why you don't compare a measles vaccine to something the akin to reparatory infection, or starts that way (flu, C19, etc).....and why some of that works very well (measles, tetanus), and some vaccines don't (flu, C19, etc).

I'm glad my daughter got the non-mNRA version the (pseudo-)vaccine.
We left it up to her .... we didn't care that much.
But wife and I thought it was extra extra stupid since she had tested positive for it once (natural immunity), is 20 y.o., and in good health..
Since she is in the nursing program at college, they MADE her get it.

Other facts are interesting. Like the virus can only infect certain cells with the right receptors. Where as the mRNA vaccine, can get into almost any cell. The virus starts at the lung, and/or respiratory tract ....sure it moves on from there, but that's where the main battle ground is or should be. The vaccine is shot straight into the blood/tissues of the body.

None of this stuff was rigorously tested over a long term period for long term side-effect as it should of been.
Nah, didn't bother. Like I said, he's a quack. See sources below.

https://www.factcheck.org/person/john-campbell/

https://fullfact.org/health/john-campbe ... -children/

https://healthfeedback.org/authors/john-campbell/

"Then on 20 January, Dr John Campbell, a retired nurse educator who has amassed a huge following on YouTube, released a video describing the figures as a "huge story" and suggested Covid deaths were "much lower than mainstream media seems to have been intimating"."

https://www.bbc.com/news/60145237

And if you're really bored, you can click on all the fun sources for his Wikipedia page.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Campbell_(YouTuber)

Etc., etc., etc...

Quack.

Not going to argue discuss the whole testing protocol for vaccines. I've been down that road one too many times and have zero desire to repeat it.
I didn’t watch the video and don’t care about this individual, but the idea that Covid deaths were initially over-counted seems reasonable. (From-Covid and with-Covid may have been initially conflated.)
I think imperfection of initial counts has been acknowledged, this doesn’t seem like quackery territory.
"Deaths which would not have been counted in the 17,000 include people with asthma, diabetes, an irregular heartbeat or high blood pressure - all conditions with which many can expect to live a normal lifespan. In other words, these are not terminal conditions that would have killed people had they not caught Covid."

https://www.bbc.com/news/60145237

It is quackery territory in the sense that the individual in question positions himself as a respectable source of knowledge but then engages in click-bait style discussions. I'm sure the statistics on Covid deaths weren't 100% accurate. Nothing is. But that doesn't mean that only 17,000 people (like he claimed) died from Covid and the rest of the deaths were made up. Like the article said, many of the deaths discounted in the 17,000 people figure ignores deaths from people with high blood pressure who, you know, weren't dead prior to contracting Covid. I picked that condition because it's not exactly "rare". 47% of the U.S. (based of quick Google-Fu) population has it - see link below.

To be clear - I'm not picking on this dude because he's part of the anti-Covid crowd. I'm picking on him because he's full of shit, and as a medical professional, he should know better. Which means, to me, that one of two things are true - either he's dumb (doubtful) or he's deliberately misleading in his presentation of information in order to support his own views (which also happen to be nonsense in this particular case), which would qualify for quackery.

https://www.cdc.gov/bloodpressure/facts.htm
I hadn’t watched the video. I misunderstood your criticism. I agree that 17k seems low for an honest accounting.

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Re: Coronavirus

#9395

Post by mbasic » Wed Apr 12, 2023 8:53 am

hector wrote: Tue Apr 11, 2023 1:57 pm
Brackish wrote: Tue Apr 11, 2023 1:36 pm
hector wrote: Sun Apr 09, 2023 1:03 pm
Brackish wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 8:59 am
mbasic wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 8:15 am
Brackish wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 7:49 am
mbasic wrote: Sun Mar 26, 2023 3:27 pm
Presented without comment? I've read this dude is a quack...actually, both of them are.
Did you watch the video? I can't put a few words into a simple TL;DW synopsis, sorry.

And Sources for allegations of quackery?


Funny becasue Dr. Campbell was very pro vaccine/pro mask/pro social interview for much of the (beginning of the) pandemic.
That/he changed once the data on natural immunity came out, coupled with the fact omicron was 'different', and those two things verses the whole risk vs reward calcs at that point going forward.

Some of the (factual) stuff is still really interesting ...how the mucosal immunity system works. And say why you don't compare a measles vaccine to something the akin to reparatory infection, or starts that way (flu, C19, etc).....and why some of that works very well (measles, tetanus), and some vaccines don't (flu, C19, etc).

I'm glad my daughter got the non-mNRA version the (pseudo-)vaccine.
We left it up to her .... we didn't care that much.
But wife and I thought it was extra extra stupid since she had tested positive for it once (natural immunity), is 20 y.o., and in good health..
Since she is in the nursing program at college, they MADE her get it.

Other facts are interesting. Like the virus can only infect certain cells with the right receptors. Where as the mRNA vaccine, can get into almost any cell. The virus starts at the lung, and/or respiratory tract ....sure it moves on from there, but that's where the main battle ground is or should be. The vaccine is shot straight into the blood/tissues of the body.

None of this stuff was rigorously tested over a long term period for long term side-effect as it should of been.
Nah, didn't bother. Like I said, he's a quack. See sources below.

https://www.factcheck.org/person/john-campbell/

https://fullfact.org/health/john-campbe ... -children/

https://healthfeedback.org/authors/john-campbell/

"Then on 20 January, Dr John Campbell, a retired nurse educator who has amassed a huge following on YouTube, released a video describing the figures as a "huge story" and suggested Covid deaths were "much lower than mainstream media seems to have been intimating"."

https://www.bbc.com/news/60145237

And if you're really bored, you can click on all the fun sources for his Wikipedia page.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Campbell_(YouTuber)

Etc., etc., etc...

Quack.

Not going to argue discuss the whole testing protocol for vaccines. I've been down that road one too many times and have zero desire to repeat it.
I didn’t watch the video and don’t care about this individual, but the idea that Covid deaths were initially over-counted seems reasonable. (From-Covid and with-Covid may have been initially conflated.)
I think imperfection of initial counts has been acknowledged, this doesn’t seem like quackery territory.
"Deaths which would not have been counted in the 17,000 include people with asthma, diabetes, an irregular heartbeat or high blood pressure - all conditions with which many can expect to live a normal lifespan. In other words, these are not terminal conditions that would have killed people had they not caught Covid."

https://www.bbc.com/news/60145237

It is quackery territory in the sense that the individual in question positions himself as a respectable source of knowledge but then engages in click-bait style discussions. I'm sure the statistics on Covid deaths weren't 100% accurate. Nothing is. But that doesn't mean that only 17,000 people (like he claimed) died from Covid and the rest of the deaths were made up. Like the article said, many of the deaths discounted in the 17,000 people figure ignores deaths from people with high blood pressure who, you know, weren't dead prior to contracting Covid. I picked that condition because it's not exactly "rare". 47% of the U.S. (based of quick Google-Fu) population has it - see link below.

To be clear - I'm not picking on this dude because he's part of the anti-Covid crowd. I'm picking on him because he's full of shit, and as a medical professional, he should know better. Which means, to me, that one of two things are true - either he's dumb (doubtful) or he's deliberately misleading in his presentation of information in order to support his own views (which also happen to be nonsense in this particular case), which would qualify for quackery.

https://www.cdc.gov/bloodpressure/facts.htm
I hadn’t watched the video. I misunderstood your criticism. I agree that 17k seems low for an honest accounting.
yeah brackish is either being intentionally obtuse, like the article he quoted, or is uninformed....and just taking internet stuff at face value (which I myself am also guilty of at times)

This article: https://www.bbc.com/news/60145237
How did the claims spread?
The misleading "17,000" figure was spread by influential accounts online. On 14 January, former Islamist turned counter-extremism activist Maajid Nawaz tweeted that the figures were evidence of "narrative collapse", implying the larger reported death figures were not genuine.

Then on 20 January, Dr John Campbell, a retired nurse educator who has amassed a huge following on YouTube, released a video describing the figures as a "huge story" and suggested Covid deaths were "much lower than mainstream media seems to have been intimating".
Is mostly about some other people other than Campbell, but the article mentions Campbell's video when the ONS information was released (Campbell's video of Jan 20, '22).

The Campbell video only shared the information that 17,000 people in the UK had Covid as the ONLY cause of death on their death certificate, whereas everyone else had covid+one or more comorbidities. In the video, which the article threw him under the bus for, Campbell states a couple of time, "I am of course NOT saying only 17,000 people died of covid". (said that 2 or 3 times I believe)

The video was more about how the average age of death from covid (or "covid-only", the "17,000") was clear up at 82.5 or something, which isn't that much higher than the regular average age of death. And how (sad it is that) say a 31 year old male might get his testisclar cancer diagnosis missed (31 is the ave, age of ball-cancer diagnosis), due to all the shutdowns and other silly shit that went on during that period. So that guy looses his nuts, and or dies .... meanwhile we are all worried about Martha , who is going to die in the next six months to a year.

----------------

Also for example, the wikipedia segment on campbell being a quack when it comes to Ivermectin/"horsepaste": I think he has had followup videos on that, going back and forth whether THE STUDIES show horsepaste is effective or not. You could pick out a certain one at a certain time in a certain and formulate a quackery narrative about Campbell. He even had a video, AFTER everyone (The Science, Fauci, main stream media) had poo-poo-ed on horse-paste .... a video showing it was interesting how STILL the CD-fucking-C and NIH was STILL looking at horse-paste as an adjunct anti-viral specifically for sars-cov-2.

I would agree that the guy is a little too click-baity.....but he does bring up a lot of interesting points from a medical perspective. Like the aforementioned thing with cancer diagnosis being pushed aside and we would pay in spades for that. The video was Jan, 2022. The reason excess mortality is high lately (last 9 months?) is probably because of that very thing.

He was very pro mask at the beginning, and has flip-flopped on that.

He was pro-vaccine at the beginning, but since The Science showed natural immunity is in fact a thing (big surprise), and the virus has mutated into something akin to a common cold .... he's flipped on that too. There's really no point for these nationalized mass vaccine plans any longer, especially given the minor risks with youth, etc. (sure, some old/immunocomp'd people should get vaxxed I guess).

Go fact check the CD-fucking-C when they said COVID didn't spread human to human (only animal to human was the implication).
Yes, they briefly said this at the very onset of the outbreak when it was still in china. 'member that? I do.
....because they didn't want to hurt china's feelings or something-something????

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Re: Coronavirus

#9396

Post by SSJBartSimpson » Wed Apr 12, 2023 9:44 am

I don't know about you guys, but I have noticed that ever since I got the vaccine all of my lifts have improved by around 100-200 lbs. I would definitely recommend the vaccine for the gainz.

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Re: Coronavirus

#9397

Post by Hardartery » Wed Apr 12, 2023 11:31 am

mbasic wrote: Wed Apr 12, 2023 8:53 am

Also for example, the wikipedia segment on campbell being a quack when it comes to Ivermectin/"horsepaste": I think he has had followup videos on that, going back and forth whether THE STUDIES show horsepaste is effective or not. You could pick out a certain one at a certain time in a certain and formulate a quackery narrative about Campbell. He even had a video, AFTER everyone (The Science, Fauci, main stream media) had poo-poo-ed on horse-paste .... a video showing it was interesting how STILL the CD-fucking-C and NIH was STILL looking at horse-paste as an adjunct anti-viral specifically for sars-cov-2.

I would agree that the guy is a little too click-baity.....but he does bring up a lot of interesting points from a medical perspective. Like the aforementioned thing with cancer diagnosis being pushed aside and we would pay in spades for that. The video was Jan, 2022. The reason excess mortality is high lately (last 9 months?) is probably because of that very thing.

He was very pro mask at the beginning, and has flip-flopped on that.

I am not voicing an opinion for or against any of this, but I wanted to point out that Ivermectin exists as a pharmaceutical in carefully calibrated doses, and this is not exactly the same product as the horse paste. Any studies I am sure would be done using the actual manufactured for humans variety, which is cheap and easy and ethically acceptable to study and very different than the stuff sold for horses. Sitting in a third world location right at this moment where it was used as part of the barrage of medication launched at Covid, I would say that I have a couple of packages in the drawer but we did not use them when my wife got Covid. There is no way of knowing if it was of any value at all, they world at large did not treat it as a controlled scientific study. My gut feeling is that it did nothing at worst, but probably delivered a placebo effect at best. If it worked, the secondary barrage of meds would not have been necessary where I am sitting.
The main problem with the horse paste variety is dosing, a lot of morons took too much of it because it's not that easy to calculate the correct dose for something made for a different species without a little specific knowledge that most people don't possess and apparently have trouble Googling it.

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Re: Coronavirus

#9398

Post by cgeorg » Thu Apr 13, 2023 11:56 am

mbasic wrote: Wed Apr 12, 2023 8:53 am The Campbell video only shared the information that 17,000 people in the UK had Covid as the ONLY cause of death on their death certificate, whereas everyone else had covid+one or more comorbidities. In the video, which the article threw him under the bus for, Campbell states a couple of time, "I am of course NOT saying only 17,000 people died of covid". (said that 2 or 3 times I believe)

The video was more about how the average age of death from covid (or "covid-only", the "17,000") was clear up at 82.5 or something, which isn't that much higher than the regular average age of death. And how (sad it is that) say a 31 year old male might get his testisclar cancer diagnosis missed (31 is the ave, age of ball-cancer diagnosis), due to all the shutdowns and other silly shit that went on during that period. So that guy looses his nuts, and or dies .... meanwhile we are all worried about Martha , who is going to die in the next six months to a year.
Well ok, but if half of the population has a co-morbidity, it does matter how many people died of covid+asthma, or covid+fat, or covid+___. It's not all for 82.5 year old Martha who would have been gone soon.

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Re: Coronavirus

#9399

Post by mbasic » Mon Apr 17, 2023 5:04 am

cgeorg wrote: Thu Apr 13, 2023 11:56 am
mbasic wrote: Wed Apr 12, 2023 8:53 am The Campbell video only shared the information that 17,000 people in the UK had Covid as the ONLY cause of death on their death certificate, whereas everyone else had covid+one or more comorbidities. In the video, which the article threw him under the bus for, Campbell states a couple of time, "I am of course NOT saying only 17,000 people died of covid". (said that 2 or 3 times I believe)

The video was more about how the average age of death from covid (or "covid-only", the "17,000") was clear up at 82.5 or something, which isn't that much higher than the regular average age of death. And how (sad it is that) say a 31 year old male might get his testisclar cancer diagnosis missed (31 is the ave, age of ball-cancer diagnosis), due to all the shutdowns and other silly shit that went on during that period. So that guy looses his nuts, and or dies .... meanwhile we are all worried about Martha , who is going to die in the next six months to a year.
Well ok, but if half of the population has a co-morbidity, it does matter how many people died of covid+asthma, or covid+fat, or covid+___. It's not all for 82.5 year old Martha who would have been gone soon.
meh, if you overlay the age blocks of people who died from conoravirus with the total number of people in those blocks, people under 65 really weren't that affected (seems like a big death number, but a huge populous). Sure people died, but compared to the huge number of people there, it wasn't a lot.

There's been quite a few studies ("The Science") modelling that all of the silly lockdown stuff we did had little affect on the spread of the virus, and that didn't save many lives, if any (....practically). Sure, still warp speed your vaccine and all that (in 2020-2021). But it seems we are paying the price now is excess deaths for late diagnoses of cancer and cardio problems .... and we really don't need to piss away any resources pushing a vaccine program that's not needed anymore.

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Re: Coronavirus

#9400

Post by mouse » Mon Apr 17, 2023 7:58 am

SSJBartSimpson wrote: Wed Apr 12, 2023 9:44 am I don't know about you guys, but I have noticed that ever since I got the vaccine all of my lifts have improved by around 100-200 lbs. I would definitely recommend the vaccine for the gainz.
On the flip side the one shot I got back in the day was only a week or two prior to my bicep tendon deciding to peace the fuck out from my shoulder...

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