Who does maintenance between cuts?
Moderator: Manveer
-
- Registered User
- Posts: 887
- Joined: Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:55 am
Who does maintenance between cuts?
I haven’t found a thread on this topic and it is where I currently find myself. I lost some weight over a couple months and now I am going to work at stability for a similar period before I return to deficit nutrition. Perhaps it’s not as glamorous as getting super lean on a cut or bulking, but now that I’ve looked into it, I’m excited by the idea of reaching a goal and actual long term success.
Who’s done this? Any advice?
Who’s done this? Any advice?
- 5hout
- Registered User
- Posts: 1573
- Joined: Wed Jun 26, 2019 5:32 am
Re: Who does maintenance between cuts?
I found this harder than bulking or cutting, and it usually turned into accidental bulk or accidental cut. The two things that I would recommend are:
1: No hypertrohpy workouts, either lift for maintenance or 1rm. You need some volume to keep your gains, but remember that since you won't be building muscle (or much muscle) you can use that extra time for cardio, joint health, 1rm work, learning/practicing other lifts (snatch, clean, jerk, ohp). If you're doing 3 day + OHP day MM (Sorry Hanley if this butchers your program) this basically cuts 1 entire day out, so you can redistribute the work across the days and still have time for more cardio/ohp/fun lifts.
2: I planned my eating/weigh-in schedule as Friday morning weigh in, Monday weigh-in, and then Mo/Tu/Th fast/intermittent fast/caloric restriction appropriate to what happened between Fri and Mo. You might not need a Monday weigh-in, but you do need to adapt your week-to-week eating to how 'bad' the weekend was for your weight. Of course in Rona times might not be as much of an issue. This way you don't oopsie into gaining 4 lbs because you do every 3rd week weigh-ins, you know (based on food records + weigh-in) how that weekend went and what corrective action you need that week to stay level. Essentially, a mini-mini-bulk/cut cycle based on my eating and social habits. Yours may differ
1: No hypertrohpy workouts, either lift for maintenance or 1rm. You need some volume to keep your gains, but remember that since you won't be building muscle (or much muscle) you can use that extra time for cardio, joint health, 1rm work, learning/practicing other lifts (snatch, clean, jerk, ohp). If you're doing 3 day + OHP day MM (Sorry Hanley if this butchers your program) this basically cuts 1 entire day out, so you can redistribute the work across the days and still have time for more cardio/ohp/fun lifts.
2: I planned my eating/weigh-in schedule as Friday morning weigh in, Monday weigh-in, and then Mo/Tu/Th fast/intermittent fast/caloric restriction appropriate to what happened between Fri and Mo. You might not need a Monday weigh-in, but you do need to adapt your week-to-week eating to how 'bad' the weekend was for your weight. Of course in Rona times might not be as much of an issue. This way you don't oopsie into gaining 4 lbs because you do every 3rd week weigh-ins, you know (based on food records + weigh-in) how that weekend went and what corrective action you need that week to stay level. Essentially, a mini-mini-bulk/cut cycle based on my eating and social habits. Yours may differ
- Wilhelm
- Little Musk Ox
- Posts: 9728
- Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2017 3:58 pm
- Location: Living Room
- Age: 62
Re: Who does maintenance between cuts?
There are some thoughts on maintenance training here -Cellist wrote: ↑Tue Dec 15, 2020 4:32 am I haven’t found a thread on this topic and it is where I currently find myself. I lost some weight over a couple months and now I am going to work at stability for a similar period before I return to deficit nutrition. Perhaps it’s not as glamorous as getting super lean on a cut or bulking, but now that I’ve looked into it, I’m excited by the idea of reaching a goal and actual long term success.
Who’s done this? Any advice?
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=3785
I had my own feelings about the lack off effectiveness of bulking at my age.
Testiclaw pretty much unequivocally confirmed that view.
fwiw, i have been holding steady at 200lbs AM weight since mid summer, after gaining back from 180 after my 3.5 month pre/post surgery layoff.
I recently started the MM 3 week template squat portion, and it's a lot more volume than i had been doing.
I find my self ranging from 2,800 ish daily calories, to 3,200 and even 3,400 some days.
This while ranging from 199lbs to 201.
There are days when i can feel i can use more food.
I don't get hungry in the standard way since i've been LCHF for so long, but it's like i can feel my muscles wanting more some days.
I think there is room to effectively have a surplus for specific periods and still basically be at maintenance.
I weigh myself everyday, and track all calories all days.
Tracking is just a habit i developed in 2016 when i first started losing 50 lbs over 6 months.
I don't even think twice about it now.
I had already figured i was losing time by cutting and bulking compared to just training full volumes, and Testiclaw stated it in exactly that way.
"normalized over time"
I added a second day of weighted dips, and i can already see a difference in fullness for chest and shoulders.
So it's not like nothing is happening.
I'm just starting new 12 week mesos, and essentially a 9 month macro built from those.
Definitely looking to PR my deadlift after 2nd meso. Last heavy single of the first meso is scheduled to be 3lbs under current PR, but i may not test after the 1st meso.
I'm also now more focused on getting results from this squat plan after kind of purposely putting "numbers" to the back burner for that lift.
That stemmed from me just doing my own thing that wasn't getting me over the hump after getting back close to pre surgery levels.
I'll let you know how it goes, but i pretty much expect to follow the plan i have laid out, and to hit my loading targets.
Well see.
-
- Young Padawan
- Posts: 1507
- Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2017 9:34 pm
Re: Who does maintenance between cuts?
I like keeping a small deficit, perma-cutting. I've lost about 20 pounds using ~100 kcal per day deficit. It doesn't feel any different than maintenance. It takes a long time, but the idea that a diet ends is a recipe for disaster anyway.
-
- Registered User
- Posts: 250
- Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2018 5:49 am
Re: Who does maintenance between cuts?
Same deal for me. Gently losing around 1lb a month. Hardly notice it and managed to drop my waist to drop to a new low.
- Wilhelm
- Little Musk Ox
- Posts: 9728
- Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2017 3:58 pm
- Location: Living Room
- Age: 62
Re: Who does maintenance between cuts?
After not training in a surplus from Oct 2022 to after my March 23rd 2024 meet, i have arrived at perma maintenance at about 81.5kg
Oct 2022 - 95.25kg/210lb
March 18th 2023 meet day - 84.7kg
I dieted down and then did 6 weeks maintenance leading into that meet.
This year, March 23rd 2024 meet day weigh in was 72.8kg
Just an insane experiment
next meet will be my first in -82.5kg class, which i managed to skip over completely going from -90kg to -75kg
I may at some point go over 82.5kg again, but right now the thought of being in a deficit gives me PTSD flashbacks.
I've added enough insulation since weigh in day that long term maintenance will be fine for regaining/increasing strength levels.
As i was gaining backthis year, i was doing high reps/high volume squats, and high reps/volume secondary bench (incline) and lots of one arm KB rows.
Sadly, dips and pullups are still out of the rotation for me due to my shoulder.
Shoulder is good for benching now, and i have to keep it that way.
Oct 2022 - 95.25kg/210lb
March 18th 2023 meet day - 84.7kg
I dieted down and then did 6 weeks maintenance leading into that meet.
This year, March 23rd 2024 meet day weigh in was 72.8kg
Just an insane experiment
next meet will be my first in -82.5kg class, which i managed to skip over completely going from -90kg to -75kg
I may at some point go over 82.5kg again, but right now the thought of being in a deficit gives me PTSD flashbacks.
I've added enough insulation since weigh in day that long term maintenance will be fine for regaining/increasing strength levels.
As i was gaining backthis year, i was doing high reps/high volume squats, and high reps/volume secondary bench (incline) and lots of one arm KB rows.
Sadly, dips and pullups are still out of the rotation for me due to my shoulder.
Shoulder is good for benching now, and i have to keep it that way.
- Wilhelm
- Little Musk Ox
- Posts: 9728
- Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2017 3:58 pm
- Location: Living Room
- Age: 62
Re: Who does maintenance between cuts?
Yesterday after deficit snatch grip deadlifts.
AM weight today 179.5lb, and i've dropped calories to around 2,675/2,700 which is 15cal per lb for 178.
Going to do my best to just hold steady here until November, and then March as well.
- Wilhelm
- Little Musk Ox
- Posts: 9728
- Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2017 3:58 pm
- Location: Living Room
- Age: 62
Re: Who does maintenance between cuts?
Been steady at 179lb AM weight for going on a week now.
And for 24 days 180lbs is highest, with 178.5 the lowest.
I've got it dialed.
I don't want to go above the 82.5kg/181.88lb class limit at all
-
- Registered User
- Posts: 2950
- Joined: Fri Oct 20, 2017 2:03 pm
- Location: Ft Collins, Colorado
- Age: 40
Re: Who does maintenance between cuts?
@Wilhelm geez bro you look juiced #no natty
jk, keep it up
jk, keep it up
- Wilhelm
- Little Musk Ox
- Posts: 9728
- Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2017 3:58 pm
- Location: Living Room
- Age: 62
-
- Registered User
- Posts: 2950
- Joined: Fri Oct 20, 2017 2:03 pm
- Location: Ft Collins, Colorado
- Age: 40
Re: Who does maintenance between cuts?
Haha thats funny bc I was gonna ask you that, but its sort of a sensitive topic for some, so i just went ahead and made the juicing joke instead.
-
- Registered User
- Posts: 1522
- Joined: Wed Jun 17, 2020 1:35 pm
Re: Who does maintenance between cuts?
I thought he was on TRT?
- Wilhelm
- Little Musk Ox
- Posts: 9728
- Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2017 3:58 pm
- Location: Living Room
- Age: 62
Re: Who does maintenance between cuts?
Nope.
Not that it "proves" anything, but I compete in USAPL, (8 meets so far) and have been tested once after a meet.
USAPL does not allow/give TUEs for TRT
Not that it "proves" anything, but I compete in USAPL, (8 meets so far) and have been tested once after a meet.
USAPL does not allow/give TUEs for TRT
-
- Registered User
- Posts: 1522
- Joined: Wed Jun 17, 2020 1:35 pm
Re: Who does maintenance between cuts?
Oh nm then, I was thinking of someone else that logs here.
-
- Registered User
- Posts: 15
- Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2023 11:32 am
Re: Who does maintenance between cuts?
Wow, congratulations on your achievements. I find it really difficult to maintain the same weight myself, I don't always watch what and when I eat.
- Wilhelm
- Little Musk Ox
- Posts: 9728
- Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2017 3:58 pm
- Location: Living Room
- Age: 62
Re: Who does maintenance between cuts?
This is the first time i have tried to be this precise with maintenance.
Trimming 40 calories by going to 1Tbsp half&half in each cup of coffee, leveling the PB in the Tbsp before it goes on the toast...
Just eating the exact same things in the exact same amounts everyday.
I've been pretty much doing that for years, but now even moreso.
It's weird,(I'm weird) but i actually like it.
- broseph
- High Fiber
- Posts: 5017
- Joined: Sun Sep 17, 2017 6:11 am
- Location: West Michigan
- Age: 41
Re: Who does maintenance between cuts?
I permabulked from 180 to 230 over a couple years and got pretty fat (as you might imagine).
When I decided to stop being so fat, I slowly cut back down. I found maintenance breaks to be absolutely necessary for preserving strength and muscle. I'd "easily" lose a certain amount, then things would get tough, and eventually I'd be weak and flat. Then I'd take several weeks of maintaining (or very slight gaining) to get (some) gainz back before rinsing and repeating.
Now that I'm older and have (what I consider) a decent amount of muscle and leanness, I typically stay between 185 and 195 and always do a maintenance period after bulking or cutting. It's like, your gainz (either leanness or muscle mass) need to settle in and become a semi permanent thing before switching gears or they are too easily lost.
When I decided to stop being so fat, I slowly cut back down. I found maintenance breaks to be absolutely necessary for preserving strength and muscle. I'd "easily" lose a certain amount, then things would get tough, and eventually I'd be weak and flat. Then I'd take several weeks of maintaining (or very slight gaining) to get (some) gainz back before rinsing and repeating.
Now that I'm older and have (what I consider) a decent amount of muscle and leanness, I typically stay between 185 and 195 and always do a maintenance period after bulking or cutting. It's like, your gainz (either leanness or muscle mass) need to settle in and become a semi permanent thing before switching gears or they are too easily lost.
- CheekiBreekiFitness
- Registered User
- Posts: 726
- Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:46 am
Re: Who does maintenance between cuts?
@broseph what is the typical length of each period (bulking, maintaining, cutting) that you have found works best for you ?